Someone linked to me a pretty good description of the case built for the perceived Judgment Day, that we're all hopeful for, in a few days. May 21,2011 to be exact.
Now the thought of it does, I will admit, get me giddy as a school girl inside. To rationally believe it will happen? I cannot trust it. The Bible says not to. Way too much has to happen, as described in the Bible, that yet has come to fruition.
Gulp, I just said this as Obama was speaking about Israel today. Yikes! (More on that in a moment)
Don't get me wrong I am one to believe the winding clock is losing its spring tension and that stopping moment is very near. All evidence points to it. It will be abrupt and sudden but not in a few days. We all can feel the apocalyptic times we are currently in though. If you don't feel it winding down, then you're in denial.
I believe its merely a money thing. It makes a great story to sell. What else can it be? A Cure for Cancer will not even hit the media headlines, if money is not involved! Its all for money, the love of which is the root of ALL evil.
Fill the pews for a few days? Fill the collection plates? Why? What happens on May 22nd? Empty pews again. We should NEVER want to merely fill the pews or go after the quick buck in book sales. We seek to get soundly saved Christians, for all eternity, no matter when Christ comes. The urgency is there, but an exact date? Dangerous and pointless.
The Bible is clear that NO MAN, or angel, will know that exact date when Christ comes. Period. How do we KNOW this?
Because Christ Himself said so. (Matthew 24:36, Mark 13:32) Even He did not know at the time He was here performing miracles and offering Himself to save all of mankind. So if Christ Himself at the time didn't know, then I am confident that no one else does. No one is above Christ. That is what people are trying to do here. Its wrong to think you're above our Lord, in knowledge or anything, that is for sure.
But, in that same breath, as Matthew 24:33 is clear about, Jesus said we all WILL KNOW when that time is near. Just not the day and hour.
What about all these Atheists wringing their fists? Are we not here to be good stewards and witnesses to God's kingdom? Why set dates then?
If the Bible says that we will be mocked with "There is peace and security," It certainly does not describe these days here today. I can see that happening after 2012 though. Imagine in 2013 everyone being mocked, especially by the Atheists, with "Where's all the destruction? Where are all the wars?" "There is peace and security now, not the end of times *pshaw" I do see that. I am not predicting anything though. I merely am postulating a point.
Dude! "The status quo is unsustainable," Obama just said today. "A lasting peace will involve two states for two peoples."
Maybe, I spoke too soon. What is going on here? Is this President trying to end the world by mocking God today? God was pretty clear when He gave the land to His chosen.
"for all the land that you see I will give to you and to your offspring forever." ~Genesis 13:15 (ESV)
"Did you not, our God, drive out the inhabitants of this land before your people Israel, and give it forever to the descendants of Abraham your friend?" ~2 Chronicles 20:7 (ESV)
God was clear that this was their land and that whoever divides it will perish.
"I will gather all the nations and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat. And I will enter into judgment with them there, on behalf of my people and my heritage Israel, because they have scattered them among the nations and have divided up my land," "Multitudes, multitudes, in the valley of decision! For the day of the LORD is near in the valley of decision." ~Joel 3:2,14
RUN!!! Go get into your makeshift caves and disaster shelters! RUN!! Sell it all!
Wait a minute!
"The sky vanished like a scroll that is being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place. Then the kings of the earth and the great ones and the generals and the rich and the powerful, and everyone, slave and free, hid themselves in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains, calling to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who is seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb, for the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?" ~Revelation 6:14-17
Never mind, go about your day. The future is not avoidable.
Trusting in Christ, thus evidence of repentance, is indeed your ONLY hope. Beg if necessary for that gift. Psalms 51:17, 2 Timothy 2:25
I am going to make some lemonade, or sun tea, and enjoy the days.
"We all can feel the apocalyptic times we are currently in though. If you don't feel it winding down, then you're in denial."
ReplyDeleteThat's strange, I don't feel anything. You live in USA, right? That winding down feeling, isn't the end of the world, its just the impending fall of America as world power, due to incompetent economic and foreign policy.
People are going crazy with apocalyptic predictions because they see end to their way of life after America loses its status as super power, and they can't imagine life without it.
D.A.N,
ReplyDelete>>Don't get me wrong I am one to believe the winding clock is losing its spring tension and that stopping moment is very near. All evidence points to it. It will be abrupt and sudden but not in a few days. We all can feel the apocalyptic times we are currently in though. If you don't feel it winding down, then you're in denial.
>> The Bible is clear that NO MAN, or angel, will know that date. Period. How do we KNOW this. Because Christ Himself said so. (Matthew 24:36, Mark 13:32)
Are you not contradicting yourself in here D.A.N? First you say that the “that stopping moment is very near and in the next sentence you say that NO MAN, or angel, will know that date. So how do you know/believe the end is near if your bible says no one will know when the end of times will happen?
>> Even He (jesus) did not know at the time He was here performing miracles and offering Himself to save all of mankind. So if Christ Himself at the time didn't know, then I am confident that no one else does. No one is above Christ. That is what people are trying to do here. Its wrong to think you're above our Lord, in knowledge or anything, that is for sure.
Ok. According to Christianity:
- Jesus is god in human form;
- God is omniscient;
- Since Jesus is also god therefore he’s also omniscient;
So, if jesus/god didn’t know when the end of times would occur he’s not that omniscient, right?
MaxFF,
ReplyDelete>>That winding down feeling, isn't the end of the world, its just the impending fall of America as world power, due to incompetent economic and foreign policy.
Touché, my friend. Well played.
The "second coming" was supposed to happen while Jesus's direct followers (those who saw him directly, not through "faith") were still alive. It didn't happen. It failed. Of course, modern christians go for indefinite postponement. They don't think it will ever happen. They just pay lip service.
ReplyDeleteMhich(cherie?),
ReplyDelete>>Are you not contradicting yourself in here D.A.N? First you say that the “that stopping moment is very near and in the next sentence you say that NO MAN, or angel, will know that date.
Yes, that is true, no one knows the exact date, but we will know around the time just by the signs like 2 Timothy 3:1-5 points out. This also is no big surprise because of what science says too. Second law of thermodynamics, Law of Increased Entropy, states that everything will, and is winding down. Yes, the Bible was right yet again if you are keeping score.
>>So, if jesus/god didn’t know when the end of times would occur he’s not that omniscient, right?
I am thinking, as a man, He was not omniscient at that window of time. He is now, sitting on the thrown. I might be wrong here. I am going on what is said in His word. Maybe some Biblical scholar can "school" us on that point. I will look into it though.
D.A.N,
ReplyDelete(Yes, it’s bellecherie here. Sometimes I use this account when my main account “bellecherie” on google doesn’t work, like now. You know how google goes crazy from time to time.)
>> Yes, that is true, no one knows the exact date, but we will know around the time just by the signs like 2 Timothy 3:1-5 points out. This also is no big surprise because of what science says too.
Those signs? Come on D.A.N, since the beginning of the human race (and human civilization) that always had been selfish and egocentric people, greedy people, proud and arrogant people, abusive people, disobedient children, ungrateful people, heartless people, unappeasable/slanderous people, people with no self-control, brutal people, conceited people, etc and the world didn’t end.
It’s like those people who says that all the wars, natural disasters, financial crises, terrorist attacks, epidemics, violent dictatorships and famine are signs of the end of the times (A + B + C+D = apocalypse). Again, all of those things happened in every period of human history and the world didn’t end (the black plague that killed half of Europe in the Dark Ages – people back then thought the world was ending and it wasn’t).
Obviously the human race will eventually disappear (we won’t exist forever) and our planet will perish too (earth is not eternal either), but we can’t know when is going to happen and how is going to happen.
Wait a second, I take that back. The end of our planet (for good) will happen in 4 billion years from now the Sun will begin to die; he will consume all of his hydrogen and then helium and it will expand becoming colder and less bright. The sun will also become a big giant red ball and it will swallow the planets closer to him (earth included, of course). Then the sun will cool, shrink, it won’t have any nuclear reactions and he will become a white dwarf. When the sun loses all his heat he will become a black dwarf. That will be (really) the end of everything for our small planet.
In a nutshell: the world is going to end eventually but the reasons why will have nothing to do with people in general’s behaviors and actions.
D.A.N. said...
ReplyDeleteIt will be abrupt and sudden but not in a few days.
Lol, you say the Bible says no-one knows the date/time but then you deny it could be this weekend. Quality job in contradicting yourself there Dan. Either no man truly knows, in which case it could still happen this weekend and Camping only got it right by pure luck or, it is possible to work it out and Camping is right because his information comes from the only guy who does know, you know, the guy who is capable of revealing things to people such that they can be certain of them through revelations such as the Bible.
Since when has a winding down ever been 'abrupt and sudden'? You Christians have been wittering about 'end times' for 2000 years - that has to be the least abrupt and sudden winding down ever known.
A Cure for Cancer will not even hit the media headlines, if money is not involved!
It would, if it was an actual cure for cancer and not a gross misrepresentation of the science.
Freddies dead,
ReplyDelete>>It would, if it was an actual cure for cancer and not a gross misrepresentation of the science.
Erm, you do understand that PZ is basically agreeing with me.
"This is why an independent academic community with research funded for knowledge rather than profit is so important, and really emphasizes why we cannot afford to privatize all biomedical research."
But thanks for that info.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteD.A.N,
ReplyDeleteOf course that if a cure for cancer or AIDS was discovered (as long as being the real deal) would hit the headlines, even though not having money involved.
Most of you have probably heard about the Christian group claiming that the rapture will be this Saturday, May 21st, 2011. Although the 'appointed hour' for the alleged rapture has not passed yet, I'm going to be cocky and assume that it's not happening. I have some thoughts on the whole issue:
ReplyDelete1. A lot of you Christians are going on internet forums arguing that the people making this claim are not true Christians, and that all true Christians know that people will not know the date of the rapture. You say that it could happen tomorrow, it could happen thousands of years from now, etc. In other words, no real Christian would betray the religion by making a claim that is even possible to be proven false, regardless of whether or not it actually is false. Your mainstream Christian claims are unfalsifiable, untestable. Nothing happened today? Well, that's exactly what our book says. Our god isn't around making its presence known? That's exactly what our book says. I think that's a pretty accurate description of religion in general. The ones that are still around have survived this long, ironically, through a Darwinian process in which religions that made specific falsifiable claims had to die out because they were shown to be false. I'm not aware of any major modern religion which makes any specific, testable claim on any aspect of its belief system.
2. For anybody who quit their job and/or gave away all of their money because of this particular belief, you are incredibly stupid and you deserve what you get. For those who have dependent children, your children deserve better than you as parents.
3. You deserve what you get because you have failed to recognise your particular religion as exactly the same as all of the others that exist in the world, just a story with no evidence made up by primitive men to explain the Universe around them. You failed to ask for any real evidence. You may have been provided Bible verses as proof, but you failed to ask for evidence that what is in the Bible should be taken seriously.
http://www.atheistpropaganda.com/
We all can feel the apocalyptic times we are currently in though. If you don't feel it winding down, then you're in denial.
ReplyDeletePeople throughout history have believed they were living through significant times, and have been waiting for the climax of the story. Except it doesn't happen, and life rolls on. We just like to think that we're playing starring roles in our own stories, and that our stories have some kind of cosmic significance. Human hubris at its finest.
D.A.N. said...
ReplyDeleteFreddies dead,
>>It would, if it was an actual cure for cancer and not a gross misrepresentation of the science.
Erm, you do understand that PZ is basically agreeing with me.
"This is why an independent academic community with research funded for knowledge rather than profit is so important, and really emphasizes why we cannot afford to privatize all biomedical research."
But thanks for that info.
Where in there does PZ agree that "A cure for cancer will not even hit the media headlines, if money is not involved!"? Answer: Nowhere. Ergo he's not agreeing with you. Instead, you've misrepresented the article. My point (and PZ makes the same objection) was that the reason the "Cure for Cancer!" claims were being ignored wasn't because the research wasn't backed by tons of money, but because those claims aren't true. There is no cure therefore it's not possible to ignore it due to lack of money.
Any cure for cancer would be a sure fire media hit, regardless of how much money it took to develop.