I did a post a while ago called Science needs a better god. I was pointing out how man is intervening with the natural order that God set out. The adverse effects of such manipulations with genetic engineering are yet to be determined and may pose a real problem with mankind.We also recently, in the comments of a past post, were discussing IVF's and abortions. It reminded me of this show I watched on PBS a while back. I was able to find it and I will link to it here.
The old saying of "you are what you eat" is not fully accurate anymore. A more accurate saying would be "your grandchildren are what you eat" There is something going on in the science industry that is fascinating. They are discovering something called Epigenetic switches in our epigenome, in that, the environment has a huge role in the development of many generations.
In relation to the IVF's that we were discussing they have found diseases to form by the mere fact that the kids were IVF babies. God's perfect plan is being manipulated and pushed aside for our desires and the results are bad. We must trust God.
God has designed a system that, if manipulated improperly, has very dire and adverse consequences. While the scientists of today genetically alter our milk, vegetables, meats, our environment through pesticides and insecticides, and such could trigger some of these switches that can be dire for our grandchildren survival. Vaccines may be causing more harm then we could ever imagine. Our intake, our stresses, our lifestyles all effect our great grandchildren.
Mankind is manipulating the environment too much.
Also in an older post, called In the cult of science, it was pointed out "Technology and science, though they are cumulative and have improved, in many ways, the lives of people within the industrialized nations, have also unleashed the most horrific forms of violence and death, and let's not forget, environmental degradation, in human history."
The negative effects of these manipulations are yet to be fully understood. We may see some horrible things happen to our families in the near future. Our genomes are being manipulated at an alarming rate and should be understood better before blatant, if any, manipulation.We hear in commercials of all these 'serious' side effects warnings that the pharmaceuticals have on our bodies, one can only imagine what effect they will have on our great grandchildren.
So who do you trust God or man's plan?
Please watch the show. It will be worth it and may get you to think of the lifestyle that you are living. We are truely the ambassadors to our genetic code for our future generations. Live a lifestyle that is pleasing to our genome and God.
The show is called "Ghost in your Genes", it is too important to miss in my opinion. Please consider watching it.
Atheists places too much trust in Man, this show may help you understand, yet another reason, how wrong that viewpoint (worldview) may be.
A good tree will bear good fruit. We must keep God's Creations more sacred then we are. As I said, Science has no moral rudder and the ship is adrift. Our future may depend on you understanding this point.
Ghost in your Genes, Part 2, Part 3, Part 4
bit.ly/EpigeneticSwitches
Yeah, I don't like scientists either.
ReplyDeleteIt's funny how you'll watch a show and pretty readily accept that:
ReplyDelete"They are discovering something called Epigenetic switches in our epigenome, in that, the environment has a huge role in the development of many generations."
Wow, you better toss this aside, sounds a bit like evolution... This is exactly what evolution is, that "the environment plays a huge role in the development of many generations".
Geez, Dan, you know how hypocritical this sounds?
Interesting show though!
ReplyDeleteIt's evolution though, you do realize that don't you?
ReplyDeleteAndrew,
ReplyDelete>>It's evolution though, you do realize that don't you?
I realize that is what is assumed but there is no evidence of such a thing.
Oh and DM, your straw man is funny but I like science. It is the scientists presuppositions that I don't care for.
"scientists presuppositions that I don't care for."
ReplyDeleteThose "presuppositions" upon you refer are the bedrock upon which the scientific method rests. It's like being for ice cream when you're animately against the use of milk.
You don't like science. You like something akin to "creation science," which has the about the same scientific merits as alchemy.
If you hate genetic tinkering so much, Dan you should know that the corn, bananas, etc that we eat are NOT what originally grew in the wild. People did cross-breeding and whatnot on them to get what we now have.
ReplyDeleteYou see, "Gods' original" corn and bananas just didn't cut it. If you don't like it, then I assume that you'll stop eating things like them in the future.
I wrote:
ReplyDeleteIt's like being for ice cream when you're animately against the use of milk.
Animately = adamantly - Sorry spell checker got the better of me.
"Vaccines may be causing more harm then we could ever imagine."
ReplyDeleteIm sure its likely humans will find some problems with vaccines and make some mistakes along the way,but mostly they do their very best to make sure they dont make to many mistakes.They dont often go out of their way to try to cause humans harm,that would be very very silly because they are humans themselves as are all their families and children also.
Imagine if human never dared try making vaccines,simple snake bites would even be still the death of many folks today.When bacteria and viruses etc mutated and started killing mega folks worldwide,nobody would bother trying to do anything much about it.It would almost be imposible to control,and things like bubonic plagues etc would just kill and kill hundreds of thousands.
Sadly god never helped many of those poor folk back in the days of the black plauge to be able to continue living,and i fail to see how without the help of science and medicine folks would really have much better chances even now.
I agree with you Dan we humans do need to try to be careful ..But we must not be to careful that we start getting to afraid to even try to learn anything new at all.
And sure we will have some mistakes a long the way..The main things is that any mistakes we do have we also try to learn from them so as not to keep forever making these same mistakes.
Good to hear you're against scientists, Dan. Thanks for coming out with that. This explains a lot. ;)
ReplyDelete>>Good to hear you're against scientists, Dan.
ReplyDeleteHow did you come to that conclusion from "It is the scientists presuppositions that I don't care for."?
*sigh, silly atheists.
Hey, I ain't the one saying that a sky-daddy made scientists who plan to destroy the world or something like that... XD
ReplyDeleteOr something like that?
ReplyDeleteMaybe not intentionally but certainly they will destroy quite a bit with the presupposition that there is no God. They would be far more careful if they believed the truth that they were messing with the perfect system that God created and that their actions would be judged.
Too bad the scientists haven't come up with anything demanding that an intelligence is required for the universe to work besides the flawed irreducible complexity notion, because if they did, then they would have to accept the laws of the Bible, as that is the only thing capable of keeping us from being wicked child-rapers.
ReplyDeleteAccording to your worldview (moral relativism), there is nothing wrong with being wicked child-rapers. eww.
ReplyDeleteHave you ever considered that atheists can value the life of a child and the rights of mankind to continuance in peace WITHOUT the aid of a multi-thousand year old book? It is possible, you know. ;)
ReplyDelete>>It is possible, you know.
ReplyDeleteYou cannot without borrowing from the my (Christian) worldview. I can only refer you to these posts for more reading on that subject.
Sorry Dan, where was the copyright date next to "morals"? Oh wait, it's not there, snaps...
ReplyDeleteDan +†+ said...
ReplyDeleteOr something like that?
Maybe not intentionally but certainly they will destroy quite a bit with the presupposition that there is no God. They would be far more careful if they believed the truth that they were messing with the perfect system that God created and that their actions would be judged.
What "perfect system" is that? I thought Christians believed we live in a fallen creation?
Dan +†+ said...
ReplyDelete>>It is possible, you know.
You cannot without borrowing from the my (Christian) worldview. I can only refer you to these posts for more reading on that subject.
Fallacy of the stolen concept - committed every time a Christian posits any objective standard - something he/she cannot account for from within their inherently subjective worldview so has to borrow from the objectivist atheist worldview.
According to the Christian worldview, raping a child is just as bad as telling a white lie.
ReplyDelete"You cannot without borrowing from the my (Christian) worldview."
ReplyDeleteUntrue. The concept of morality predates christianity and so cannot have borrowed from it. Furthermore, your bible has endorsed wholesale slaughter. If anyone here is of the mind that "anything goes" it is the christian.
Here's an example of "morality" from Bodie Hodge of Answers in Genesis.
ReplyDelete"Here's an example of "morality" from Bodie Hodge of Answers in Genesis."
ReplyDeleteOh Dan, I have to see if you agree with this. Please, please let us know.
>>Oh Dan, I have to see if you agree with this. Please, please let us know.
ReplyDeleteWell I read it (finally) and I agree there is no need to lie. If a man were to come to my house to find his wife in order to do harm to her I would say something like. "Yes, she is safe with me and you cannot see her until you calm down and we, as men, can discuss it."
In the case of the Nazi's, the soldiers had a duty to protect the innocent and overthrow Hitler's dictatorship and restore God's gift of liberty. They certainly failed to do so. Shame on them.
I did a post about it earlier.
There is no need to lie, ever. I have not even lied to my kids about Santa or tooth fairies. We must not willingly sin. I am certainly not self righteous by any stretch of the imagination though. If Satan is the Father of lies I was certainly the prince of lies at one point of my life before being saved. My Dad taught me that to lie is to gain in the corporate world. That "creative accounting" was merely a necessary evil to get ahead in the world.
Look, If I steal a loaf a bread to feed my family, then I am a thief. Period. If any family comes to our front door starving, we would do all we could to help that family. There is no need to steal, God will provide if you keep that faith in Him. He will never, ever, let you down.
Dan
ReplyDeleteIn the case of the Nazi's, the soldiers had a duty to protect the innocent and overthrow Hitler's dictatorship and restore God's gift of liberty. They certainly failed to do so. Shame on them.
Those soldiers thought that Hitler was a godsend. Do some reading about German history. "Hitlers Willing Executioners", "On the Jews and Their Lies" by xian Martin Luther, "Mein Kampf" by Hitler were he continually sucked up to xians.
I did a post about it earlier.
There is no need to lie, ever. I have not even lied to my kids about Santa or tooth fairies. We must not willingly sin.
So telling the german soldiers that you have jews hidden in your house is NOT a sin, even when you know god-damned fucking well what's going to happen to them?
Xians like you must have been very useful to the reich.
I'd have loved to see how you'd try to reason with the nazi soldiers at your door.
Though hopefully, since you claim to hold the truth in such high regard, you'd have told the any Jews that you would not be able to hide them, since your xian "morality" would force you to let the nazis know where they were.
Now for this next pile of bovine feces:
Look, If I steal a loaf a bread to feed my family, then I am a thief. Period. If any family comes to our front door starving, we would do all we could to help that family. There is no need to steal, God will provide if you keep that faith in Him. He will never, ever, let you down.
If there was any truth to that shit at all, there'd be no need for all those parasites to be begging for "love offerings" and donations on tv all the fucking time.
Look at the poverty rates in the bible belt.
Sure...prayer works...keep deluding yourself.
Dan, in the OT wasn't there a story about a prostitute who hid some spies sent from Joshua when they were scouting some city their "god" wanted them to take down?
ReplyDeleteJoshua 2:1-14? Read Verses 3 to 5 please where she lies about their whereabouts.
Didn't she get spared because of that? See Joshua 6:25
>>Those soldiers thought that Hitler was a godsend.
ReplyDeleteAnd if they were "of God" they would of known better.(John 10:27) They were evil and everyone can plainly see that.
>>I'd have loved to see how you'd try to reason with the nazi soldiers at your door.
With my Saiga 12 shotgun of course. According to our Constitution, we have the right and a duty to do so you know.
>>Though hopefully, since you claim to hold the truth in such high regard, you'd have told the any Jews that you would not be able to hide them, since your xian "morality" would force you to let the nazis know where they were.
Just the opposite, I would let the Jews in and fight to keep out those Nazis who were legally wrong.
Dan
ReplyDeleteJust the opposite, I would let the Jews in and fight to keep out those Nazis who were legally wrong.
Dan, you do realize that eventually the nazis would just surround, then beat your place down, right? Do you really think that you could hold them off forever?
Are you that stupid? All you've done is needlessly endanger both the lives of the Jews you're hiding, and your family.
Besides that, you've given the Jewish people a false sense of security if you convinced them that you can protect them from the Nazis after fucking letting the nazis know you have them!
It's common sense: The krauts outnumber and outgun you; no matter how many guns of whatever kind you have...they have more people!
If nothing else they can use tanks or firebombs on you.
How in hell are you going to do this?
Fight to the last man? Then the Jews you're "protecting" are dead anyway.
Just throw the Nazis off the damned trail!
Do you not think?? Did you not even read the little bible story from Joshua I posted earlier where she did lie, and they had no problem with it?
So, if the bible is the "absolute guide" to morality, why do you not follow her example? There's no hint that God or Joshua, etc found her lying to be wrong...
Now, as to true xians knowing that the Nazis were wrong, then I guess that Martin Luther was not a true xian then. He wrote "On the Jews and Their Lies", which Juluis Streicher in the Nuremberg trials, said would have put Luther in the same docket as the rest of them, since they were only following his advice.
As an aside: The nazis hated many of the same groups that the modern religious right does today. "liberals", "gays", "socialists", etc.
ReplyDelete>>Do you really think that you could hold them off forever?
ReplyDeletePhilippians 4:13 "I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me."
It does not say 'some things' but all things. I am sure Goliath thought he could win the fight with David also. (1 Samuel 17) Now I am not claiming God bends to my own will either. If God moved me to house Jews then He would of provided a way to win against the Nazis aggression.
>>Are you that stupid?
That is a relative term from abhorrent thoughts.
>>All you've done is needlessly endanger both the lives of the Jews you're hiding, and your family.
Doing the right thing is anything but needless. From that remark it appears that if you were part of the Nazi clan you would be throwing people in those chambers. You know to save your family. Or you would turn away the families pleading for their lives for some help? I would rather risk my entire family then to conform to evil. If that is stupid to you then I want to champion stupid in your eyes.
>>The krauts outnumber and outgun you; no matter how many guns of whatever kind you have...they have more people!
Immortals? we put their name to the test said Dilios.
'This is where we hold them! This is where we fight! This is where they die!'
'Taught never to retreat, never to surrender. Taught that death on the battlefield in service to (God) was the greatest glory he could achieve in his life.'
A new age has begun, an age of freedom. And all will know that a few Christians gave their last breath to defend it.
>>Now, as to true xians knowing that the Nazis were wrong, then I guess that Martin Luther was not a true xian then.
Are you claiming that true Christians are never wrong?
>>As an aside: The nazis hated many of the same groups that the modern religious right does today. "liberals", "gays", "socialists", etc.
That is a completely false and misleading statement on your part.
We do not hate anyone, we love our neighbors enough to warn them of their sinning and our pleas to change are to help their Salvation, not to damn them. I will be the one hugging you the hardest and longest when I see your face in Heaven Reynold, you can count on that.
Dan +†+ said...
ReplyDelete>>Do you really think that you could hold them off forever?
Philippians 4:13 "I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me."
It does not say 'some things' but all things. I am sure Goliath thought he could win the fight with David also. (1 Samuel 17) Now I am not claiming God bends to my own will either. If God moved me to house Jews then He would of provided a way to win against the Nazis aggression.
So you are deluding yourself, and those you'd "protect", then...I daresay that history is full of people who thought the way you did, and died trying. God didn't see fit to save the Jews in the German ghettos, now, did he? And they had more at hand to defend themselves than you would.
I mean...just think of the people in history who must've thought the way you did, and died because of it. All the last stands, etc.
Are you that stupid?
That is a relative term from abhorrent thoughts
No, that's an accurate term for abhorrent thoughts!
All you've done is needlessly endanger both the lives of the Jews you're hiding, and your family.
Doing the right thing is anything but needless.
Telling the Nazis that you're hiding Jews is not the right fucking thing! Lying to those sociopaths to throw them off the trail to protect human life is!
From that remark it appears that if you were part of the Nazi clan you would be throwing people in those chambers. You know to save your family. Or you would turn away the families pleading for their lives for some help?
You lying fuck. Where in my statemtent of:
Fight to the last man? Then the Jews you're "protecting" are dead anyway.
Just throw the Nazis off the damned trail!
did you possibly get that meaning?
I thought I was being obvious: I'd take the Jes in, if I had someplace to actually hide them, and I'd tell the krauts a snow story to send them away empty-handed.
I would rather risk my entire family then to conform to evil. If that is stupid to you then I want to champion stupid in your eyes.
Given the way that you've made total fucking mash out of what I was saying, I'd say that you're able to do that easily. Being self-righteous is one thing: being self-righteous because you're too stupid to understand what the other person is trying to say is another!
What I would do, is what I said in my previous statement: I'd throw them off the trail. Anything else would just get you, your family, and those who you're "protecting" killed.
How the hell you can possibly twist that into me fucking volunteering them up to the nazis is something you're going to have to explain in your next post.
I love that you accuse me of "false and misleading statements" after that stunt you just pulled.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, I noticed that you still never noted the story from Joshua that I brought up earlier which showed a woman lying to protect Joshua's spies. Neither God nor Joshua condemned them.
Why do you keep ignoring it?
Now, on to more of what you said:
A new age has begun, an age of freedom. And all will know that a few Christians gave their last breath to defend it.
Or, as history shows is more likely, to take it away. Just look at how you people are treating the gay community, or how the bible supports slavery, etc.
Read The Arrogance of Faith and The Jew and The Cross.
Now, as to true xians knowing that the Nazis were wrong, then I guess that Martin Luther was not a true xian then.
Are you claiming that true Christians are never wrong?
Nope, but it sure seems weird that such "holy spirit" guided people could make such huge bugger-ups!
But God forbid a "darwinist" were to ever make that kind of "mistake", eh? You people are forever trying to pin things like antisemitism on us, when in reality, it was a xian tradition for hundreds of years before Luther ever came on the scene.
Boy, that's a lot of "true christians" that were wrong, eh? Too bad "god" never saw fit to correct them.
So, how do you know that you people are right about the things that you people are going on about now?
Hindsight is 20-20 eh? Especially when it lets you dodge the consequences of the beliefs of your religious community. Meanwhile, feel free to take credit for anything good in the world...
As an aside: The nazis hated many of the same groups that the modern religious right does today. "liberals", "gays", "socialists", etc.
That is a completely false and misleading statement on your part.
Considering that nonesense about how you twisted my saying that one should "throw the nazis off the trail" of the Jews one is hiding into "throwing them into the gas chambers"...you have GOT to be kidding!
We do not hate anyone, we love our neighbors enough to warn them of their sinning and our pleas to change are to help their Salvation, not to damn them.
Hah! So all that talk by Dobson, Falwell, etc about the "homosexual agenda", or the "liberals" who are out to take xianity away from the public square, or the atheists "war on christmas" or whatever other bloody screeds you can find on WorldNet Daily, etc are not hatred?
Read the "After Eden" and "Creationwise" cartoons by Dan Lietha on the Answers in Genesis site. You'll see what I mean. If not, let me know and I'll point some out to you.
Reynold:
ReplyDeleteAs an aside: The nazis hated many of the same groups that the modern religious right does today. "liberals", "gays", "socialists", etc.
That is a completely false and misleading statement on your part.
No, it's accurate: nazis put homosexuals into the TRUE death camps also. They were made to wear pink triangles.
Also, read "Mein Kampf" for more info.
So, I'm curious how you can debunk something (atheism) that makes no claims?
ReplyDeletedebunk definition
☆ de·bunk (dē buŋk′)
transitive verb
to expose the false or exaggerated claims, pretensions, glamour, etc. of
atheism makes no claims. It is theism that makes the claims -- they are simply not accepted by atheists.
Best you learn about the words you use BEFORE you use them.
**CORRECTION:
ReplyDeleteBarnacle,
>>atheism makes no claims
Possibly, but Atheists and their worldviews sure do. That is why we call ourselves Debunking Atheists
Not atheism. Get it? The individual not the belief system.
That is perfectly understandable though, many atheists make many mistakes about the little things. It's all in the details. Welcome.
Dan,
ReplyDeleteI agree with the sentiments of this post. Humans should not be manipulating our food. Herbicudes and pesticides development is in an arms race with nature. Humans make a pesticides, nature adapts, another stronger pesticide is made, nature adapts, now an even stronger pesticide is required... so on and so on.
However your post should swap all the words "god" with nature and "design" with adoptation.
Ant,
ReplyDelete>>Humans make a pesticides, nature adapts, another stronger pesticide is made, nature adapts, now an even stronger pesticide is required.
I am very surprised, pleasantly, that you hold these views. If you believe this, then you should know that no matter what the human population does to this so called "environment" it will have little, if none at all, effect on this planet. That global warming by mankind is a farce, and the earth will do just fine with or without mankind. I am sure Gore will fly all around the world in his g5 Learjet to argue that point but truth is truth no matter how 'comfortable' he is.
Humans DO have an effect on the envirnoment and planet. The other life on this planet other than humans would be better off without us for sure. However since we humans Do wish to continue as a species we have to co-exsist with nature. Nature/life will adapted to any changes however will we (humans) be able to adapted aswell?
ReplyDeleteEnd of humans could be when a plauge of diseases has emmunity to all our antibiotics.